[MCP] limiting access: immigrants exploited?

Wed Mar 14 16:20:16 EDT 2007

I am just trying to understand you better, Teri. Are you implying that
people who're bilingual do not speak grammatically correct English? You are
*not* at a disadvantage *because* you speak grammatically correct English.
You are at a disadvantage because you do not speak the language that they
want their potential applicants to speak. There's a distinction.

That said, I was the top two or three candidates for a few jobs that I'd
interviewed for last summer. I didn't get the jobs and one feedback that I
received consistently was that they were not sure if I (perhaps as an Asian
female, who also happens to be small) would/could be assertive enough to do
the job!

On 3/14/07, Teri <uforje at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I'm just curious with all the focus on multiculturalism and immigrants and
> their rights, where exactly do I fit in?  I am African American, can trace
> my family back to pre-Civil War, English is my first and only language,
> which I speak well since I was an editor and I'm college educated.
>
> Yet more often these days, I am running into a barrier when looking for a
> new job because *they want someone who is bilingual*.
>
> *When did speaking grammatically correct English in the United States
> become a disadvantage* and who is concerned about the people affected by
> that development?
>
> Teri
>
>
>
> *Marni Rabin-Marron <mtmarron3 at yahoo.com>* wrote:
>
>  Felix,
> Good one! We know that assimilation has been a pipe dream.  But
> exploitation? I dont know.  Yes, they have almost always taken the
> low-paying jobs, but so what?  A man comes here, alone or with people
> depending on him, and he does what he can to move forward.  If he is not
> qualified for the better-paying jobs, he does what he can and lays his hopes
> on the next generation.  Haven't we all been bouyed and/or burdened by the
> dreams of our fathers?
> On the language question, in order to move forward, those people have had
> to learn English because, until fairly recently, there was no other option.
> Learn English or accept the dregs of the employment possibilities.  My
> question is: are we helping our young people or doing them a disservice
> byallowing them to remain outside of the "business language" of the nation?
> tom
>
> *Felix Reyes <flex_tech_computers at hotmail.com>* wrote:
>
> It is precisely that attitude that I am speaking of. I did know what was
> meant by America, but in the higher sense should we say it? Isn't it
> ignore
> to do so? To assume that America equals the United States. When Spanish is
>
> as you say the language of most of the Americas. And that was my point. As
>
> far as knowing more than one language it makes sense in a global economy.
> Don't we want to complete as a nation? Furthermore, you speak of the
> division that is caused by maintaining two languages, isn't the real
> question why are immigrants buying into this "America"? To be accepted
> requires that you assimilate, yes! However that alone does not ensure that
>
> one will be accepted. So how many immigrants are accepted, or rather
> should
> I ask how many are exploited?
>
>
> >From: mcp-request at edchange.org
> >Reply-To: mcp at edchange.org
> >To: mcp at edchange.org
> >Subject: MCP Digest, Vol 25, Issue 22
> >Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 12:00:02 -0400
> >
> >Send MCP mailing list submissions to
> > mcp at edchange.org
> >
> >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > http://edchange.org/mailman/listinfo/mcp_edchange.org
> >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > mcp-request at edchange.org
> >
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> > mcp-owner at edchange.org
> >
> >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >than "Re: Contents of MCP digest..."
> >
> >
> >Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. Re: limiting access (Marni Rabin-Marron)
> >
> >
> >----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Message: 1
> >Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 06:12:10 -0700 (PDT)
> >From: Marni Rabin-Marron
> >Subject: Re: [MCP] limiting access
> >To: "Multicultural Pavilion's discussion group on equity, social
> > justice, and multicultural education."
> >Message-ID: <110065.62965.qm at web62507.mail.re1.yahoo.com>
> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >
> >Alright, Spanish is the language of much of the Americas. Still, we all
> >know what was meant by "America" when he said Spanish is the norm. Now,
> to
> >take another side: Why should we consider it such? Is it useful for
> >nation to have a second language (or two first languages ala Canada)?
> Does
> >it harm us as a nation to encourage the division inherent in maintaining
> >two languages?
> > I'm not married to the idea of an "official" language, but I am
> >interested in where the conversation can lead us.
> >
> >Felix Reyes wrote:
> > Education we are speaking about but come on sound intelligent when you
> >say
> >"Spanish in America should be the norm" what you mean is the United
> States.
> >America isn't the US, AND FURTHERMORE SPANISH IS SPOKEN IN "AMERICA" OF
> THE
> >SOUTH AND CENTRAL, AND THE NORTH.
> >
> >
> > >From: mcp-request at edchange.org
> > >Reply-To: mcp at edchange.org
> > >To: mcp at edchange.org
> > >Subject: MCP Digest, Vol 25, Issue 19
> > >Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 12:00:02 -0400
> > >
> > >Send MCP mailing list submissions to
> > > mcp at edchange.org
> > >
> > >To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > > http://edchange.org/mailman/listinfo/mcp_edchange.org
> > >or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > > mcp-request at edchange.org
> > >
> > >You can reach the person managing the list at
> > > mcp-owner at edchange.org
> > >
> > >When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > >than "Re: Contents of MCP digest..."
> > >
> > >
> > >Today's Topics:
> > >
> > > 1. Re: limiting access (Bill Braun)
> > > 2. Re: Educator or Eductor (Bill Braun)
> > >
> > >
> > >----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >Message: 1
> > >Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 08:58:58 -0400
> > >From: Bill Braun
> > >Subject: Re: [MCP] limiting access
> > >To: "Multicultural Pavilion's discussion group on equity, social
> > > justice, and multicultural education."
> > >Message-ID: <45F3FD12.2000801 at hlthsys.com>
> > >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> > >
> > >Steve, what is the fraction of the children of immigrants who learn
> > >English and learn it well?
> > >
> > >Bill
> > >
> > >Steve Moynihan wrote:
> > > > I'm not criticizing them for the pace at which they learn or the
> > > > struggles they have when learning - its the indignation that
> speaking
> > > > Spanish in America should be the norm.
> > >
> > >-------------- next part --------------
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> > >
> > >------------------------------
> > >
> > >Message: 2
> > >Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 09:01:13 -0400
> > >From: Bill Braun
> > >Subject: Re: [MCP] Educator or Eductor
> > >To: "Multicultural Pavilion's discussion group on equity, social
> > > justice, and multicultural education."
> > >Message-ID: <45F3FD99.9070905 at hlthsys.com>
> > >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> > >
> > >James, does your organization have any connection to or dealings with
> > >the Knowledge Works folks?
> > >
> > >Bill Braun
> > >
> > >James H. Allen wrote:
> > > > Greetings:
> > > >
> > > > I know that many of us are enjoying our spring break, and deservedly
> > > > so. I begin this time of the year to provide "food-for-thought."
> > > > Often I have been asked why do I misspell-Educator. I then explain
> > > > that "Eductor" has its own meaning, and so I present to you those
> > > > differences.
> > >
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> > >------------------------------
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> > >
> > >For more equity, social justice, and multicultural education resources
> > >vist:
> > >
> > >EdChange: http://www.edchange.org
> > >Multicultural Pavilion: http://www.edchange.org/multicultural
> > >Nat. Assn. for Multicultural Education: http://www.nameorg.org
> > >
> > >End of MCP Digest, Vol 25, Issue 19
> > >***********************************
> >
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> >For more equity, social justice, and multicultural education resources
> >vist:
> >
> >EdChange: http://www.edchange.org
> >Multicultural Pavilion: http://www.edchange.org/multicultural
> >Transformations Book Store: http://www.edchange.org/transformations
> >Nat. Assn. for Multicultural Education: http://www.nameorg.org
> >
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> >For more equity, social justice, and multicultural education resources
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> >
> >EdChange: http://www.edchange.org
> >Multicultural Pavilion: http://www.edchange.org/multicultural
> >Nat. Assn. for Multicultural Education: http://www.nameorg.org
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> vist:
>
> EdChange: http://www.edchange.org
> Multicultural Pavilion: http://www.edchange.org/multicultural
> Transformations Book Store: http://www.edchange.org/transformations
> Nat. Assn. for Multicultural Education: http://www.nameorg.org
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> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Multicultural
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> http://edchange.org/mailman/listinfo/mcp_edchange.org
>
> For more equity, social justice, and multicultural education resources
> vist:
>
> EdChange: http://www.edchange.org
> Multicultural Pavilion: http://www.edchange.org/multicultural
> Transformations Book Store: http://www.edchange.org/transformations
> Nat. Assn. for Multicultural Education: http://www.nameorg.org
>
>

-- 
Vun Hiew, M.A.
4S Program Coordinator
Division of Multicultural Affairs
2241 Ellsworth Hall
Western Michigan University
1903 W. Michigan Ave.
Kalamazoo, MI 49008
Phone: (269) 387-3316
Fax: (269) 387-3390
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